Yarpen Zigran
New Member
I want to open by stating that I believe Embers Adrift dungeons are designed incredibly well. They are balanced in a way so that if you have a general awareness of where the named spawn combined with an efficient party you can walk out after a couple hours with a ton of xp and a handful of upgrades for the party. EVs feel similary, but with slightly more randomness injected into the formula with more opportunities to charge your ember stone.
Overland camps in contrast are usually more accessible but often feel unrewarding and disappointing due to named barely ever showing their face. Even then, sometimes you don't have time for a multiple hour dive into a labrynth of a dungeon and instead would rather beat up large quantities of filthy Exiles that refuse to join greater society in Newhaven City. That said, I do think they could be better incentives and make for a more engaging player experience.
To understand the problem with Overland grinding in EA you first have to understand how the spawning behavior of the different named mobs out there. Please note that this is all hypothesis and has not been officially confirmed by a dev.
Named Spawning Mechanics
Traditional dungeons such as CV1, CV2, Aquifer Karst, and Undercroft have a handful of spots that a named or their placeholder (PH) have a chance of spawning. That said, the named and its PH can typically only spawn once. Until it or it's PH is killed, it will not spawn again or at all. This dilemma has a very easy solution though, kill everything! The more time you spend in the areas it spawns, the more likely you'll see it multiple times and have a chance at it's rare drop.
Ember Veins function very similarly to normal named but their placeholders are often less predictable. Example: The left side of Basi EV is filled with bunnies and every 3 chevron bunny killed opens a slot for a possible chance to spawn Barb. This becomes less predictable with zones like Emberfly EV where all of the flies are similar and placeholders are less easily distinguished from regular mobs.
The Problem w/ Overland
Overland named follow the same logic with one major difference: Distance. For example: Named Exiles in Redshore can spawn throughout the zone over multiple different camps. For now, lets focus on the Exile Lumberjack and the associated named Lumberjack Bevis. Bevis can spawn in both the Dramock's camp near the monolith and the Lumbermill further east into the zone towards the Dryfoot zone line. If a group of budding level 25's gather to clear Dramocks camp, they're going to likely be oblivious to the possibility that the much higher level (28+) camp east of them might already have Bevis within it, causing them to spend an entire evening at Dramocks without seeing a single named. The same logic can be said for Patrolman Redd who can spawn all over the map or the elusive Smithy named that not only spawn in the Mill but also the Fishing Village far to the southeast.
If you're hunting gear upgrades your options are to either hope there's groups in the other camps, or spend most of your time as a party running between camps.
Possible Resolutions:
1. In places where named can spawn in multiple camps make the camps similarly leveled. If you can spawn Lumberjack Bevis in Dramocks camp, you should be able to spawn him in the Mill and not be faced with fighting oranges when you arrive at the mill.
2. When named can spawn in multiple camps but VERY far away from one another, make their spawn behavior independent of one another. One group clearing the Dryfoot Maurader camps and Basilisk rib cages in Southwest Dryfoot shouldn't be refused a chance at seeing Overseer Kerrigan or Crag merely because nobody is engaging with the Maurader camp or Rib cages 30 minutes away on the other side of Dryfoot.
3. Remove some placeholders altogether and put the named in spaces that require group effort to access. The Ancient Lumbering Bear makes sense to be able to spawn in the Southwest Redshore Bear cave. It's hard to get to and requires clearing a few 3 chevron bears or some really cleverly placed lulls to separate it from the pack. In contrast, the rest of the 4 spots are open to the public, easily farmed by whoever wishes to kill it. At the same time, the 2 chevron Ancient Bear placeholder can exist in any one of those 4 other spots and result in a party clearing the Bear Cave to never ancounter either the Lumbering Bear or Bandit. '
4. Randomly refresh mobs in camps after they haven't been engaged with for X hours.
When this game was created, it's clear that the developers assumed that multiple groups players would saturate the overland clearing mobs on a regular basis. Today, that is not the case. Most groups that form focus their energy on dungeons or ember veins because that's where their time is most rewarded. Overland camps remain untouched while the named are picked off by overleveled players, dual boxers or potentially impromptu groups of players dedicated solely to killing the single named. I'd love to get to a point where Tuesday afternoon after a server restart isn't solely the best time of the week to hunt rare named in any Overland zone.
Thanks for reading and apologies for any misunderstanding of the spawning mechanics.
Zig/Zigran/Dradon
Overland camps in contrast are usually more accessible but often feel unrewarding and disappointing due to named barely ever showing their face. Even then, sometimes you don't have time for a multiple hour dive into a labrynth of a dungeon and instead would rather beat up large quantities of filthy Exiles that refuse to join greater society in Newhaven City. That said, I do think they could be better incentives and make for a more engaging player experience.
To understand the problem with Overland grinding in EA you first have to understand how the spawning behavior of the different named mobs out there. Please note that this is all hypothesis and has not been officially confirmed by a dev.
Named Spawning Mechanics
Traditional dungeons such as CV1, CV2, Aquifer Karst, and Undercroft have a handful of spots that a named or their placeholder (PH) have a chance of spawning. That said, the named and its PH can typically only spawn once. Until it or it's PH is killed, it will not spawn again or at all. This dilemma has a very easy solution though, kill everything! The more time you spend in the areas it spawns, the more likely you'll see it multiple times and have a chance at it's rare drop.
Ember Veins function very similarly to normal named but their placeholders are often less predictable. Example: The left side of Basi EV is filled with bunnies and every 3 chevron bunny killed opens a slot for a possible chance to spawn Barb. This becomes less predictable with zones like Emberfly EV where all of the flies are similar and placeholders are less easily distinguished from regular mobs.
The Problem w/ Overland
Overland named follow the same logic with one major difference: Distance. For example: Named Exiles in Redshore can spawn throughout the zone over multiple different camps. For now, lets focus on the Exile Lumberjack and the associated named Lumberjack Bevis. Bevis can spawn in both the Dramock's camp near the monolith and the Lumbermill further east into the zone towards the Dryfoot zone line. If a group of budding level 25's gather to clear Dramocks camp, they're going to likely be oblivious to the possibility that the much higher level (28+) camp east of them might already have Bevis within it, causing them to spend an entire evening at Dramocks without seeing a single named. The same logic can be said for Patrolman Redd who can spawn all over the map or the elusive Smithy named that not only spawn in the Mill but also the Fishing Village far to the southeast.
If you're hunting gear upgrades your options are to either hope there's groups in the other camps, or spend most of your time as a party running between camps.
Possible Resolutions:
1. In places where named can spawn in multiple camps make the camps similarly leveled. If you can spawn Lumberjack Bevis in Dramocks camp, you should be able to spawn him in the Mill and not be faced with fighting oranges when you arrive at the mill.
2. When named can spawn in multiple camps but VERY far away from one another, make their spawn behavior independent of one another. One group clearing the Dryfoot Maurader camps and Basilisk rib cages in Southwest Dryfoot shouldn't be refused a chance at seeing Overseer Kerrigan or Crag merely because nobody is engaging with the Maurader camp or Rib cages 30 minutes away on the other side of Dryfoot.
3. Remove some placeholders altogether and put the named in spaces that require group effort to access. The Ancient Lumbering Bear makes sense to be able to spawn in the Southwest Redshore Bear cave. It's hard to get to and requires clearing a few 3 chevron bears or some really cleverly placed lulls to separate it from the pack. In contrast, the rest of the 4 spots are open to the public, easily farmed by whoever wishes to kill it. At the same time, the 2 chevron Ancient Bear placeholder can exist in any one of those 4 other spots and result in a party clearing the Bear Cave to never ancounter either the Lumbering Bear or Bandit. '
4. Randomly refresh mobs in camps after they haven't been engaged with for X hours.
When this game was created, it's clear that the developers assumed that multiple groups players would saturate the overland clearing mobs on a regular basis. Today, that is not the case. Most groups that form focus their energy on dungeons or ember veins because that's where their time is most rewarded. Overland camps remain untouched while the named are picked off by overleveled players, dual boxers or potentially impromptu groups of players dedicated solely to killing the single named. I'd love to get to a point where Tuesday afternoon after a server restart isn't solely the best time of the week to hunt rare named in any Overland zone.
Thanks for reading and apologies for any misunderstanding of the spawning mechanics.
Zig/Zigran/Dradon
