Stormhaven Press Release June 2023

[Weilan]

I can only know what you choose to say and in the first post I responded to said you don't you don't play anymore and that your last Chapter purchase was Morrowind. Now you've amended your story to periodic checking on the game but with no mention of purchase beyond Morrowind. Your knowledge of the game remains lacking because you have no direct knowledge to anything beyond Morrowind, and much of what I speak of wasn't introduced until later chapters they you remain ignorant on.

It's not my job to maintain your interest? Why don't you figure out a way to do so? I will tell you that I would not rely on the overland content of any MMORPG to maintain my interest as such isn't the place interesting play tends to be. That is found in more high end content which is available in varying tiers meant for group and solo play so as to provide a wide range of challenge to suit various tastes. Most of it came after Morrowind, though.

Don't give opinions based on your out of date information of a game you haven't kept up on so now know little of.

I told you.
You don't know what you're talking about, you're just saying random things.

I told you - I install ESO almost every year and I remind myself why it sucks so bad and I don't play it anymore. Vanilla WoW still provides the best experience of overland content you can have - challenging leveling, questing, good story if you pay attention to it, immersive world. If I want to play Vanilla WoW, there are are hundreds of private servers to choose from, unlike ESO where if I want to enjoy the game back as it was before, when it used to be good, I can't because there are no official legacy servers, no private servers either.

If you don't think leveling and overland content is isn't able to maintain your interest, then you haven't played any good MMORPGs, usually trash MMOs are the ones that push you ASAP to reach end game and everything before that is just mundane and boring, because the developers weren't talented enough to make it interesting. A good MMORPG is interesting in every aspect, people who aren't interested in leveling or exploring the world are playing the games wrong. And are conditioned to strive for the end game, which as the name suggests is where the game ends. Instead of the journey being the main adventure, as it should be. Which a lot of late 90s, early 00s MMOs used to do, like Ultima Online, EQ1, RuneScape, SWG, but new games aren't built like this. And you come off as someone who hasn't played the old better games and is just accustomed to the new trash out there.

The fact that you chose to ignore my questions about how in current ESO I can stand among 10 mobs and kill them with normal attacks and not risk dying, when pre-2016 if you pull 3 mobs your level you were very likely to die, or how now I can clear a Dark Anchor with a level 10 character all by myself, no CP, no good gear, but pre-2016, I could barely reach the 2nd wave and then die miserably or how now I can solo world bosses on a character that's below level 50 and has no CP but before it was unthinkable, because world bosses were real world bosses, not just elite mobs. And the fact that you ignore addressing those things and started explaining to be how overland content is not what's important in an MMORPG, means one thing - you know very well this is true and this is messed up and you choose to ignore it, because it would mean you agree with me and the game was made dumbed-down to appease to noobs with large disposable income, because they are more than the people who want challenge and ZOS just wants money nowadays. They no longer care about the game anymore - all the decisions made in the past 7 years show this. I wouldn't be surprised if in 2024 they make the game F2P for the 10 year anniversary so they can put it on life support and focus on their next MMORPG, which they've announced not long ago.

I've played all TES games but Morrowind is the last good one and currently ESO is brain-dead trash aimed at noobs and stay at home moms whose gaming history includes Candy Crush Saga and they call themselves gamers and think they are good at ESO, because ESO has no challenge.

 

[KnightFalz]

I told you.
You don't know what you're talking about, you're just saying random things.

I told you - I install ESO almost every year and I remind myself why it sucks so bad and I don't play it anymore. Vanilla WoW still provides the best experience of overland content you can have - challenging leveling, questing, good story if you pay attention to it, immersive world. If I want to play Vanilla WoW, there are are hundreds of private servers to choose from, unlike ESO where if I want to enjoy the game back as it was before, when it used to be good, I can't because there are no official legacy servers, no private servers either.

If you don't think leveling and overland content is isn't able to maintain your interest, then you haven't played any good MMORPGs, usually trash MMOs are the ones that push you ASAP to reach end game and everything before that is just mundane and boring, because the developers weren't talented enough to make it interesting. A good MMORPG is interesting in every aspect, people who aren't interested in leveling or exploring the world are playing the games wrong. And are conditioned to strive for the end game, which as the name suggests is where the game ends. Instead of the journey being the main adventure, as it should be. Which a lot of late 90s, early 00s MMOs used to do, like Ultima Online, EQ1, RuneScape, SWG, but new games aren't built like this. And you come off as someone who hasn't played the old better games and is just accustomed to the new trash out there.

The fact that you chose to ignore my questions about how in current ESO I can stand among 10 mobs and kill them with normal attacks and not risk dying, when pre-2016 if you pull 3 mobs your level you were very likely to die, or how now I can clear a Dark Anchor with a level 10 character all by myself, no CP, no good gear, but pre-2016, I could barely reach the 2nd wave and then die miserably or how now I can solo world bosses on a character that's below level 50 and has no CP but before it was unthinkable, because world bosses were real world bosses, not just elite mobs. And the fact that you ignore addressing those things and started explaining to be how overland content is not what's important in an MMORPG, means one thing - you know very well this is true and this is messed up and you choose to ignore it, because it would mean you agree with me and the game was made dumbed-down to appease to noobs with large disposable income, because they are more than the people who want challenge and ZOS just wants money nowadays. They no longer care about the game anymore - all the decisions made in the past 7 years show this. I wouldn't be surprised if in 2024 they make the game F2P for the 10 year anniversary so they can put it on life support and focus on their next MMORPG, which they've announced not long ago.

I've played all TES games but Morrowind is the last good one and currently ESO is brain-dead trash aimed at noobs and stay at home moms whose gaming history includes Candy Crush Saga and they call themselves gamers and think they are good at ESO, because ESO has no challenge.

You're the one that doesn't know what he is talking about.

Installing ESO every year isn't going to tell you a damn thing about the current state of the game when the last chapter you purchased was Morrowind and since then the chapters released have been Summerset, Elsewyr, Greymore, Blackwood, High Isle, and Necrom. You won't have access to any of their associated DLCs without a subscription as well so have no knowledge of any of those. You're familiar with a sliver of what the game now is and nothing more.

Leveling and the overland can maintain interest, but not through difficulty. It is generally the easiest content of MMORPGs. Vanilla WoW isn't challenging to level through, nor does it have difficult overland content. It is more time consuming than recent games as far as leveling goes and retains some of the tedious elements that burdened earlier MMORPGs. Beyond that it's alright but nothing particularly remarkable at this stage.

I did mention that there is greater difficulty to be found for those that wish it. If you can't be bothered to seek that out and instead stay with the content designed to be easy that's on you. The game provides the water. You can slake your thirst with it, or not. However, as I mentioned much of what can be done came after Morrowind so you won't be able to make use of it with the current state of your account.

All for profit companies have wanted money all days since their inception. This is a moot point every time it is raised.

The single player Elder Scrolls games are irrelevant to ESO, so in response to that... whatever...

ESO provides challenge, for those that can bothered to seek it out. For those that can't the dearth of challenge they perceive in the game is on them for their lacking initiative in that regard.

 

[Saints]

You don't know what you're talking about.

I install ESO almost every year to try and get back into it and find meaning to play again, I never do. Last time I tried was a few months ago.

Leveling is so easy and stupid that it insults anyone who isn't in a vegetative state.

ESO has an incredible amount to offer and at all various levels of skill and accessibility. Realistically, it would be silly to gatekeep the casual paying audience from an established name like Elder Scrolls because they couldn't figure out how to build out a character early on. Because of this, I'll *BRIEFLY* go over a few things:

Leveling is easy, and stats are padded early on - this is true, they give a baby bump. However you star to feel the drop out around CP160. It doesn't necessarily mean the open world is suddenly more difficult, it's just at that point part of the focus turns to gear, sets, upgrades, builds, rotations, etc. The training wheels come off. On top of all this if you're doing base game content that stuff is naturally easier because of min-max builds and the community figuring things out over the last decade, class and game balances, all that typical mmo stuff. That said? Each expansion and set of DLC is more challenging and offers more engagement.

The next time you install on your annual or so play of ESO try something different - hit Veteran Arenas (Maelstrom and Vateshran Hollows are solo areans), or if you want to get a little more spicy with a group try out Vet Black Rose Prison or some Vet DLC Dungeons. Instead of tinkering around in the base game area that hasn't seen a change in 6+ years (where other games like WoW for example would just make that content redundant) ESO allows those areas breathe life, so head to High Isle, Western Skyrim, or one of the later expansion areas. The open world mobs aren't night or day difference here as the game is welcoming to solo play (especially below 50/CP160, baby bump), but the World Bosses, Harrowstorms, Bastion Nymics, and other various map events are more dangerous. When you're able to handle that content, hit up some Vet Trials and progress towards HM's, Tri-fectas, Godslayer, etc.


We are all here for similar reasons. Things we want that other mmos don't offer, things we miss from the more modern mmos, any of us could go on and on about this. There is no need to dunk on something because leveling is easy - we know leveling is easy, it is easy everywhere! On the flip side, just because some games make leveling more of a grind doesn't suddenly make that game necessarily 'more difficult' either, just slower. That be a whole 'nother conversation.

I'd rather keep this thread on point so if you are curious more about ESO or need more of a pointer to where that content is you're welcome to DM. As it sits, I'm glad Stormhaven is here making changes and offering options to try and grow the Embers community.

 

[KnightFalz]

ESO has an incredible amount to offer and at all various levels of skill and accessibility. Realistically, it would be silly to gatekeep the casual paying audience from an established name like Elder Scrolls because they couldn't figure out how to build out a character early on. Because of this, I'll *BRIEFLY* go over a few things:

Leveling is easy, and stats are padded early on - this is true, they give a baby bump. However you star to feel the drop out around CP160. It doesn't necessarily mean the open world is suddenly more difficult, it's just at that point part of the focus turns to gear, sets, upgrades, builds, rotations, etc. The training wheels come off. On top of all this if you're doing base game content that stuff is naturally easier because of min-max builds and the community figuring things out over the last decade, class and game balances, all that typical mmo stuff. That said? Each expansion and set of DLC is more challenging and offers more engagement.

The next time you install on your annual or so play of ESO try something different - hit Veteran Arenas (Maelstrom and Vateshran Hollows are solo areans), or if you want to get a little more spicy with a group try out Vet Black Rose Prison or some Vet DLC Dungeons. Instead of tinkering around in the base game area that hasn't seen a change in 6+ years (where other games like WoW for example would just make that content redundant) ESO allows those areas breathe life, so head to High Isle, Western Skyrim, or one of the later expansion areas. The open world mobs aren't night or day difference here as the game is welcoming to solo play (especially below 50/CP160, baby bump), but the World Bosses, Harrowstorms, Bastion Nymics, and other various map events are more dangerous. When you're able to handle that content, hit up some Vet Trials and progress towards HM's, Tri-fectas, Godslayer, etc.


We are all here for similar reasons. Things we want that other mmos don't offer, things we miss from the more modern mmos, any of us could go on and on about this. There is no need to dunk on something because leveling is easy - we know leveling is easy, it is easy everywhere! On the flip side, just because some games make leveling more of a grind doesn't suddenly make that game necessarily 'more difficult' either, just slower. That be a whole 'nother conversation.

I'd rather keep this thread on point so if you are curious more about ESO or need more of a pointer to where that content is you're welcome to DM. As it sits, I'm glad Stormhaven is here making changes and offering options to try and grow the Embers community.

You are more patient and sharing than I to be sure. Hopefully your generosity will be appreciated.

 

[Elloa]

All I will add to this conversation is that we intendly make the Journey (the leveling) in Embers Adrift the core of the game, because that aspect of the game in modern MMORPGs have been made "trivial" (easy or fast). We want the journey to be the core of the game. Not something you breeze through. Each step of this journey will matter. Taking the time and effort to find good equipment, to have consumables will significantly help you out through your journey. This is something worth your time, because you will not outlevel your equipment/consumables in a few hours.
We are very aware that the journey can seems long at time. We are working on completing the leveling process by adding new content to add variety. You have seen our progress since launch and you can read about our next steps in the ROAD MAP
Whilst we are listening and working with our community feedback, we do not intend to astray from our core intention with Embers Adrift. It is aimed to be a slow paced immersive journey to share with friends/other players. It will be improved, polished, and corrected over time, but it will stay what it is aimed to be.

THANK YOU for staying on topic, and to discuss the development of other games in the GAMING COMMUNITY forum - Many thanks

 

[KnightFalz]

All I will add to this conversation is that we intendly make the Journey (the leveling) in Embers Adrift the core of the game, because that aspect of the game in modern MMORPGs have been made "trivial" (easy or fast). We want the journey to be the core of the game. Not something you breeze through. Each step of this journey will matter. Taking the time and effort to find good equipment, to have consumables will significantly help you out through your journey. This is something worth your time, because you will not outlevel your equipment/consumables in a few hours.
We are very aware that the journey can seems long at time. We are working on completing the leveling process by adding new content to add variety. You have seen our progress since launch and you can read about our next steps in the ROAD MAP
Whilst we are listening and working with our community feedback, we do not intend to astray from our core intention with Embers Adrift. It is aimed to be a slow paced immersive journey to share with friends/other players. It will be improved, polished, and corrected over time, but it will stay what it is aimed to be.

THANK YOU for staying on topic, and to discuss the development of other games in the GAMING COMMUNITY forum - Many thanks

You shouldn't stray from your core intention for Embers Adrift. Maintaining your distinctiveness is your best chance for success.

I've personally been away for awhile as I could never find a tolerable graphics setting for the game. I have a new computer now, and with your new non-subscribed option I decided to see if it would provide acceptable visuals. It turned out it does and as it happens I was able to see a bit of that added since my departure. Having liked what I saw I have now subscribed for a month to give it a good look to determine if I want to play regularly.

So while I may speak well of other games, I am aware Embers Adrift has it's virtues and stands apart enough from it's fellows to have a unique draw.

 

[twilight2k]

No, we are not planning to allow players to purchase subscribers perk individually.
This is my personal opinion, but I do believe those type of transactions are very borderline with microtransactions. Ethicaly I am not at ease with that at all. What do you think?

I am generally against microtransactions (depending how you define them). However, I am all for permanent purchases for convenience (extra storage, extra character slots, etc). A good example of how to do this (mostly - there are some items in the store that do increase power) is D&D Online. They have a 3-tier free, premium (you've made ANY purchase), and subscription and sell extra storage, character slots, and similar items. It is the highest earning per player game that the owner (EG7?) currently has (it is a relatively small player base so there are other games that have a higher total earnings).

 

[Colanius]

and sell extra storage, character slots, and similar items.

I think that the main reason they don't do this is because if you can buy extra storage/character slots the whole "sub" would become pointless (and financially bad for them) with just a one-time purchase of those items.

Think about it, Without the said perks, what else does the sub give you? just a purple title, the crafting station, and a slight buff in the rings, all meaningless stuff, The strong ones are the char slots and the inventory space. Buy those individually with a one time purchase and 90% of the people will cancel the sub.

 

[twilight2k]

I think that the main reason they don't do this is because if you can buy extra storage/character slots the whole "sub" would become pointless (and financially bad for them) with just a one-time purchase of those items.

Think about it, Without the said perks, what else does the sub give you? just a purple title, the crafting station, and a slight buff in the rings, all meaningless stuff, The strong ones are the char slots and the inventory space. Buy those individually with a one time purchase and 90% of the people will cancel the sub.

If that happens, then they didn't find the right balance/pricing. DDO has lots of subscribers even though effectively everything the sub gives you can be bought in the store or earned through playing the game (the only thing that can't is a weekly roll for random reward which is normally junk).

I like Embers Adrift but I am unlikely to ever subscribe for the same reason I've come to hate MMO subscriptions (though I do subscribe to DDO) - my typical play pattern is inconsistent. I tend to play an MMO a lot for a couple months (or weeks) and then not for at least as long. If they offered the ability to purchase storage, char slots, etc then they would get money from people like me that they probably would not otherwise.

However, it is definitely a balancing act. They would need to figure out what extras work to sell and which don't. One big difference in DDO is that they sell additional storage and char slots over what you get with the subscription so even subscribers will often pick those up (and people are always clamoring for more account shared storage to buy).

 

[Pipz]

If that happens, then they didn't find the right balance/pricing. DDO has lots of subscribers even though effectively everything the sub gives you can be bought in the store or earned through playing the game (the only thing that can't is a weekly roll for random reward which is normally junk).

I like Embers Adrift but I am unlikely to ever subscribe for the same reason I've come to hate MMO subscriptions (though I do subscribe to DDO) - my typical play pattern is inconsistent. I tend to play an MMO a lot for a couple months (or weeks) and then not for at least as long. If they offered the ability to purchase storage, char slots, etc then they would get money from people like me that they probably would not otherwise.

However, it is definitely a balancing act. They would need to figure out what extras work to sell and which don't. One big difference in DDO is that they sell additional storage and char slots over what you get with the subscription so even subscribers will often pick those up (and people are always clamoring for more account shared storage to buy).

Just buy another account then dont sub. Bought storage.

 

[Elloa]

I like Embers Adrift but I am unlikely to ever subscribe for the same reason I've come to hate MMO subscriptions (though I do subscribe to DDO) - my typical play pattern is inconsistent. I tend to play an MMO a lot for a couple months (or weeks) and then not for at least as long. If they offered the ability to purchase storage, char slots, etc then they would get money from people like me that they probably would not otherwise.

However, it is definitely a balancing act. They would need to figure out what extras work to sell and which don't. One big difference in DDO is that they sell additional storage and char slots over what you get with the subscription so even subscribers will often pick those up (and people are always clamoring for more account shared storage to buy).

The reason why we have removed our obligatory monthly sub is so players like you, who do not like a monthly subscriptions can join the game and play with your friends.
However, we refuse to do start doing microtransactions. We disagree with how the monetisation in video games has turn to be over the years and we want to offer a game where every players starts equally.

Therefor as player you can choose. If the game has value to you, you can subscribe. If the game has not enough value for you to justify your subscription, then you can play the game for entierly free and access ALL the content and ALL the patches, for no extra cost on a single character that you choose.
May you subscribe or NOT subscribe, you have access to the exact same game, the exact same content and you have as much chance as anyone else to enjoy the game and be succesful at it.

We also added last patch, an extra row in the gathering bag for all